something fuzzy is growing on my Aro ... help please!

1

1goodcatch

New Member
hello
end of December I noticed that white fuzzy (like small pieces of cotton) stuff growing on the rear tail, mid-rear section of the fish and on one eye. all on the left side of the fish.
so increased the temp, added salt and treated it with Melafix and Pimafix fix not knowing if it was Fungal or Bacterial. after 3 weeks I saw an improvement and stopped medicating.

GUESS what! The fuzzy stuff is back!

All other Tank mates have no signs of this infection
It not affecting my Aro's behaviour, he is active and eats well but have noticed that he trys to rub his eye that has the white spot against things in the tank on occasion.

Tested water quality and its normal, water changes are done religiously (20% weekly). Fiteration is a Sump. PH is 6.1-6.2.

Any advise on how to get rid of this this for good? and it is caused by bacteria or fungus or parasite
I have attached pictures, the first 3 are of the left back that is infected, the next 3 are of the one eye that is infected and the last is a picture of his good side.
notice that where is stuff is growing, it has also damaged the scales :-(
thank you
 

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Looks secondary.... bacterial...

Its not a parasite, and not fungal.

Looks like columnaris, which is bacterial.

To treat, start with huge water changes(50%) and a general cleaning of the tank(gravel siphon if you have any)

Leave the temp where its at, as a higher temp will worsen it.

Maracyn and Maracyn-2 will treat it..... follow the instructions on the package.

If you dont have those meds, look for something that treats for bacterial infections, and treat for 7-10 days. A few days wont cut it...

Make sure your doing big water changes during treatment, and keep the water well aerated...


good luck.
 
I have had similar things happening in my aro tank. I tried salt and changing the water, but it didn't really do anything. I then tried SeaChem Paraguard, and it seemed to clear it up pretty good. I also had some small insect like bugs (looks like small clear fruit flys) in the water as well and actually hatch and try and fly out of the tank (they all died hitting the glass cover). What I suspect is I changed the brand of raw shrimp I feed my aro and I think the parasites/bugs were in the shrimp.

When you think about it, these shrimp are raised in ponds in places like Thailand, and I am sure they are filled with parasites and fungus. I have been to Thailand many times, and seen these type of ponds - trust me, they are not clean like a tank. Allot of people actually recommend these shrimp are not even healthy for human consumption anymore (unless its wild shrimp) with all the chemicals they use in these ponds.

If you are feeding your aro raw fish/shrimp, it maybe worthwhile to lightly boil or nuke them for a little. That is what I am going to do from now on. Since when you think about it, a parasite/fungas has to be introduced into your tank. Is a closed environment. It can't just grow out of nothing. Must be from the food or new fish. I have read it can be introduced by dry food - but I am sure that is tough given they cook the stuff.
 
I would do as motoro suggested and also up your regular water changes to atleast 40% a week with a thorough gravel vac.

I dont think that these infections are only introduced, they could come up from poor water quality ie lack of water changes
 
Lack of water changes is exactly why this appeared in this case is my guess as well, like Arrow mentioned.

Yam, get your shrimp and fish from the super market....
 
I do get them from the super market. Where else?

I lived in Asia for 10 years. I have seen some of these fish farms while travelling. If your feeding say your aro about 3-4 shrimp/fish a day. That is about 1300-1500 shrimp a year. If you think in all those raw shrimp not one will have some fungus, parasite or big...well, I think you need to pay a visit to these farms. People quaritine new fish and med wild fish all the time, but have no problem throwing pieces of raw shrimp into their tank that was grown in Thailand?

Nothing wrong with these fshrimp farms. They do the best they can, but they are basically ponds sitting outside in jungle/field. There are even problems with salmon farms in Canada with parasites. They lose tons of fish to them. So if you think in Canada they have problems with fish farming, no doubt places like Thailand have problems as well. Most of your farmed shrimp comes from Thailand or South America. Tilapia is even worse. Tons of parasites. Tilapia is just a very strong hardy fish and can live in any water condition - but that means they just just tolerate more parasites in them.

Thinking a parasite will just pop up from nowhere because of bad water is similar to when people in the medieval times thought that maggots popped out of no where on dead bodies/fecal matter. The dead organic matter just provided the opportunity, but they discovered later it was flies laying their eggs.

Water quality is imporant no doubt. I change 30% of my water at least one a week, sometimes more if I have time. Gravel clean once week as well. Got 3 cannister filters going (I think I will get a sump tho). If you have bad water, the introduction of a parasite/fungas will be worse since it gives them more fuel to grow - but for sure the parasite/fungas has to be introduced first, it can't just grow out of no where just because you have bad water.



So my advice is, even if you med and do water changes, but you don't take a look at what your introducing into the water all the time (shrimp, fish, plants) then your just setting yourself up for the same problem later.
 
The bacteria present on food, is not the same species of bacteria that caused this issue simply put...


If your buying your food from the super market.. your safe. Food marked for human consumption is more than safe for your fish....


You should see what goes into dry foods like pellets...
 
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I disagree. Shrimp you buy from the super market was not meant to be eaten raw or fed to other fish. Loblaws is not your lFS. They expect you to cook it. Unless your feeding your aro sashimi grade shrimp/fish (which would be crazy expensive), your shrimp/fish will have some parasites/fungus. That is why if you buy frozen shrimp/fish/worms from say the Hikari brand, they UV it to make sure nothing survived. They don't do that for frozen stuff from your super market since they expect you to cook it, and wash your hands when you finish cooking it. That is why they say eating shrimp now is not the greatest as the farms use tons of meds (marachite green...etc) to try and keep the fungus and parasites out.

Trust me dude. My dad owns a Chinese restaurant.

Don't believe me. Go eat a box of shrimp raw for a week. Tell me how you feel. You could be fine, could be not. I am married to a Japanese lady, eaten allot of sashimi in my time, I know of allot of people that have gotten parasites from eaten even sashimi grade fish.

Fungus is grown from spores, its different from bacteria. Bacteria is everywhere, from in the air to on your hands. Fungus - the spores has to get into your water somehow. A fungus that grows on your aro's fins (fin rot) just doesn't pop into your tank from anywhere. It is a very specific type of fungus. It has to be physically introduced. Parasites, they have to be introduced into your water physically as well.

All I am saying, you got to watch what you throw in your tank. If you think throwing raw pieces of fish/shrimp in your tank is ok just because you bought it at Loblaws your kidding yourself. I bet allot of monster fish die all the time because owners are feeding them fish/shrimp, and once in a while they get a bad one and die.

I nuke my shrimp mine for about 30 sec on low temp, my aro eats it the same. Why take the risk?
 
I want to stress here - bacteria and fungus are to very different things. What fish usually get (such as this fuzzy stuff) is fungus. Fungus are its own species.

Fish/shrimp/farmers/aquaculture have to deal with the same issues as people in the fish hobby. They are just dealing at 1000x since they have tons of livestock. When you throw in a piece of raw shrimp into your tank, whatever that fish farm had in their water is going into your tank. They did not breed that shrimp to be fed to other fish. Human consumption is very different from feeding to other live stock. If you accidently ate fish fungus in your shrimp it probably wouldn't do anything to you, and they expect you to cook your shrimp anyways.

I always read in these postings someone's aro or stingray dying without warning. Perfect water. Perfect everything. Yet, they feed their fish tons of raw shrimp and fish, and don't make the connection that the raw food could have done the job.

We are dealing with $1000-$2000 fish here, throwing some $5 cent shrimp in there and risking it is not wise I think. Cook it.
 
I should have read your first post more closely. those flys didn't come from the shrimp... not directly anyway.... not even close.

read my first post in this thread. the issue has been properly addressed.... I knew te diff between bacteria and fungus.
I think you may have thought other wise.....


if you care to start a new thread, and copy your posts over to it, I'd be more than happy to continue this discussion there, and perhaps enlighten you about some of the things your mentionig here...
 
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No, not saying my problems (fly) are from shrimp. It could be anything. But I do think the raw food I have been feeding could be a source.

All I am saying, feeding raw shrimp from your local super market can be ONE of the reasons of a problem. Its like a check list, and it should be the one of the things one should check if the problem presist. Also, there is no one solution to a problem. Keep an open mind is my opinion.

If your trying to convince me it can't be the raw shrimp/food, then please provide me with some rationale.
 
I think i made it clear already that columnaris is not a Fungus(fuzzy white stuff) it is a side effect to a bacteria. You are appearing to want to make that clear, but you dont know yourself.
If you drop a piece of food in a tank, and let it sit for a few days, you'll see white stuff on it as well. What you see there is the fungus Saprolegnia. That is a true fungus...


Food is not the problem here. The problem here is columnaris which is a symptom of a bacteria. columnaris is a very common bacterial infection in fish, based on the fact that Flavobacterium columnare is present in almost every aquarium. Now that we know why he has this problem, and how to solve it., He's well on his way to not only healing his fish, but preventing it in the future.

Columnaris has nothing to do with the food he was feeding. It was brought on by poor husbandry... it was not introduced into the aquarium via food.


Parasites found on seafood are as follows:

Nematodes(roundworm)
Cestodes(tapeworms)
Trematodes(flukes)

All of these are parasitic. These Parasites do not live on dead things(fillet and market shrimp)...

So they are not going to get into your tank... So these fish/shrimp can come from the worst places on earth, but when the fish dies.... so does the parasite.. or it looks for a new host. But it will die befor it gets to your tank....


Now we're back to Bacteria... Bacteria is the only thing you'd need to worry about. But even then, theres not a whole lot to worry about.

The bacteria most commonly found on seafood is :

Staphylococcus aureus
Vibrio parahaemolyticus

Both are basically harmless to your fish in the numbers they will be found on the food. Plus, that bactera is no match for an arowanas gut flora.


You are completely safe with feeding raw fish and shrimp.... just make sure your buying from a reputable store, and insure it is not out of date.

After that, just freeze the food when you get home... this will stop the bacteria from multiplying.

When preparing to feed, thaw it quickly in a bowl of cold water. Dont let it sit out too long... Once thawed, any bacteria present will start to multiply by double after about 20mins.



By the way... those flys your seeing, They are probably Chironomidae.
 
i had those "fruit flies" a while back. 99% sure they were from plants that i put in the tank.


1good which medication did you choose to use? and results? i have the same problem right now.
 
I don't know aros that well but with stingrays I would use nitrofurazone (found in binox) to treat bacterial problems. Very safe for all types of fish and very little damage to the bacteria in your filters. Great write up motoro and I suspect if anybody is having problems with thier fish getting sick from shrimp chances are it was thawed improperly or sat out to long after it was thawed.
 
an update
Feb 11th - did a good cleaning of the Sump and media.
feb 13th - 50% water change and cleaned gravel
treatment underway for bacteria Melafix because I dont have Maracyn, motoro do yo know where I can buy this? I live in Markham.

fish still active and so are his take mates. all eating well!
or the moment just feeding SW (about 15-20) every second day. No shrimps for the moment.
the fuzzy stuff on the eye has reduced but no on tail or on scales.
grateful for all advice
 
Motoro, I don't think your getting my point of view. If you read my first reply, I was not only talking about fungus or bacteria - I am talking about all the things one should be careful for when adding raw food to your water.

I have a friend who owns shrimp farms in Thailand. I actually have seen them. They are open ponds in fields. They take the shrimp, they give it a spray of tap water, and then start shelling them. Then go to freeze them. I assure you, plenty of chances for anything (parasites, fungus, bacteria to survive). Fungus/bacteria/parasites can survive freezing. We use to own a Japanese restaurant. They flash freeze the tuna when they catch them, and if you have a good chef, he is suppose to still make sure no parasites have survived in the meat.

Like I said, these shrimp farms EXPECT you to cook the shrimp and not feed it raw to other live stock. Tilapia is even worse. They are massed farmed now. They fully expect you to cook the fish before you eat.

Now, I am not saying if you feed raw foods your going to be screwed. You can feed for the next 10 years and nothing bad could happen, all I am saying, it could be the source of a problem and should be modified. I agree bad water further causes more problems, and can make a small problem get worse - but fungus or parasites just can't show up out of no where. They need to be "seeded" (by food, plants...etc) and then given fuel ( bad water) to grow.

Anyways, the way I dealt with my problem is daily water changes, cleaned the gravel daily for a week added some Paraguard and started nuking my shrimp. Everything is good now.

Not sure what the big deal is. My arro eat the cooked shrimp just the same. Seems like its almost easier for him to eat as the flesh is more firm and he just swallows it. What is 30 more seconds taking the time to nuke it? Helps you defrost it as well.

Hey, look, I got a dog. I am not about to go to Loblaws buy a pound of raw pork/beef and start feeding it to him (although he would like it). Sure, dogs are suppose to eat raw meat, and the dog probably would be fine. But if he got sick - I am sure it is the first thing the vet would say to stop doing. Farmed meat is different from wild meat.

Loblaws expects you to cook the meat before human consumption. You keep thinking just because something is sold from a store for human consumption its got to be alright for your fish - it has to be COOKED.

I am not saying you don't know your stuff. Clearly you seem to be a very experienced aquarium guy, all I am saying be careful what you throw into your tank. Shrimp/tilapia...etc is all mass produced now. Thinking its 100% safe no questions asked, well....whatever.
 
1goodcatch said:
an update
Feb 11th - did a good cleaning of the Sump and media.
feb 13th - 50% water change and cleaned gravel
treatment underway for bacteria Melafix because I dont have Maracyn, motoro do yo know where I can buy this? I live in Markham.

fish still active and so are his take mates. all eating well!
or the moment just feeding SW (about 15-20) every second day. No shrimps for the moment.
the fuzzy stuff on the eye has reduced but no on tail or on scales.
grateful for all advice
Click to expand...

Glad to hear this!!

Big Als sells Maracyn. Not sure if you have a store local to you, but you can order it online and get it in a day or two.

http://www.bigalsonline.ca/searchResults.mtw?query=Maracyn
 
Glad you posted this. Very interesting. I got some new wild plecos, so started using Melafix/Primflex I had around. That night I noticed the cichilids acting like there was not enough air in the tank. A few were close to dying, trying to gasp on the surface of the water to try and get air. I didn't understand it at first since I have two 2217 Enheims blasting away creating allot of surface break and oxygen. I didn't get it at all. Cichilids are very hardy.

But now that I have read this link, I think that could be it. Good thing I added another air pump before I left, and once I get home going to change the water again.
 
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